ICS

[10ENGINE]

Heard it once again today on a crash on the I

EMS COMMAND.........??

There is only ONE INCIDENT COMMAND, the rest are BRANCHES/SECTORS etc.

INCIDENT COMMANDER

SUPPRESSION BRANCH EMS BRANCH RESCUE B..

ALL of which report to the IC

[Firefighter33]

I Agree.

I took a seminar on NIMS and there were 3 branches under IC, they were : Safety, Operations, and something else. EMS is a sector that falls under safety. So if there was EMS command, then was there a safety officer reporting to the Incident commander?

[Firefighter33]

i never said there was an EMS command, i tried to make a point that there is ONE command, with 3 branches under command :safety, operations, and one that i cant remember. EMS is a sector that falls under safety.

So on an incident you have the Incident commander who should appoint a safety, operations and that 3rd thing, officer. With those officers established, something like EMS, or Medical Group should be formed under Safety with the Safety officer appointing an officer to oversee EMS operations on an incident. If at any time that EMS officer would need any additional resources, he/she would report to the safety officer who in turn would report to the Incident commander.

That's how NIMS was explained to me by the instructor. If anyone knows any different about NIMS, please, feel free to correct me.

[FFEMS23]

In York County their is One IC and EMS is known as EMS sector if it is needed. They run it the same as an EMS command but everything has to be requested through the IC.

It is ok for some things but to me it's better if the EMS sector could just contact the EMS board and request what is needed instead of having to ask the IC to request it through the fire board.

[10ENGINE]

This is exactly my point, CHAIN OF COMMAND...

When EMS contacts communications to request resources without the IC aware of it, this becomes a communications breakdown. If the IC dosn't know air medical was requested, or additional units, how can you maintain span of control, as well as accountability???

Also just another dispatcher having to monitor another channel for the same incident, and either way the info still has to be relayed back and fourth, which causes more radio traffic.

[MAYTAG]

10E,

This my take on it,

With the new radio system being developed and the eventual requirement to adopt ICS, IMS and NIMS, it is now even more of a priority to get the those 3 items put in place and also to get accountibility, MAYDAY, staffing, etc done.

My bet is that the ones that are using these terms and other "mis-uses" will not be there to help get it done, but you can bet your bottom dollar they'll be the first ones to cry about it.

[Yellowcard]

OK. People are quite good at quoting class material or the way things should be run but that's obviously not the issue. You can be book smart and quote every book out there on ICS but if you can't apply it...
That being said, EMS command does have it's applications. The important one being in a mass casualty. EMS command is vital and necessary and is (as previously stated in other posts) to be a function under the direction of a higher command. Most people however cannot apply the principle. Also, some of us from the old school were taught that in certain situations (four or more patients) it is applicable when being the first EMS unit on scene that you place your unit out of service on scene as EMS command to direct the triage and flow of pt. care. This also is to be done under direction of fire command (if it exists). Not a hard concept. The new EMS providers are not being taught any of these concepts however.

[MAYTAG]

Yellowcard,

You'll get no argument from me that EMS is a vital part of our operations, howver, there is no such a beast as EMS Command on a Fire/ Rescue operaton.

It's EMS SECTOR or SECTION.

Command is for the INCIDENT COMMANDER who has overall Command of the entire operation.

[HMWMDSpecialist]

Hey Tag the only thing I would throw in there is that it is division or group. They are not using sectors anymore according to NIMS.

[MAYTAG]

HM,

You are correct and just like many with ICS, I am not used to the NIMS yet, but we better cause it's gonna be required.

[HMWMDSpecialist]

Well due to where I work it falls under the C.O.G. and it's part of everyday operations.


Les

[Yellowcard]

Tag,
I understand and agree but I would rather use incorrect terminology in the best interest of scene management or patient care. Again, it's all in the application. Some fire commanders can control an incident, some cannot. I have been on more CF's than well run scenes. None of are perfect however and I'm sure I've been a not so bright and contributed to the playing of circus music but hey... We can all (and always) learn new tricks.

[MAYTAG]

Once again, that ugly ficticious monster by the name of ;

EMS COMMAND has reared it's ugly head.

Use the correct terminolgy please !!! It ain't that hard, I mean everyones using Side A,B,C and D after 50 years of 1,2,3,4 so why can't they do the same with ICS and the various Sectors??